Mahatma Letter No. 108: Difference between revisions

From Theosophy Wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
 
(20 intermediate revisions by 4 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
[[Category:ML from Koot Hoomi]]
[[Category:ML needs background]]
[[Category:ML needs publication history]]
[[Category:ML needs commentary]]
{{Infobox MLbox
{{Infobox MLbox
| header1 = People involved |
| header1 = People involved |
Line 11: Line 7:
| writtendate      = unknown
| writtendate      = unknown
| receiveddate      = March 1883
| receiveddate      = March 1883
| otherdate        = none
| otherdate        = unknown
| header3 = Places
| header3 = Places
| sentfrom          = unknown
| sentfrom          = unknown
| receivedat        = [[Madras, India]]   
| receivedat        = [[Madras, India]]   
| vialocation      = none
| vialocation      = unknown{{pad|9em}}
}}
}}
'''This is Letter No. 58 in Barker numbering.''' See below for [[Mahatma Letter No. 108#Context and background|Context and background]].
This is '''Letter No. 108''' in ''' [[The Mahatma Letters to A. P. Sinnett (book)|''The Mahatma Letters to A. P. Sinnett'']], 4th chronological edition'''. It corresponds to '''Letter No. 58''' in '''Barker numbering.''' See below for [[Mahatma Letter No. 108#Context and background|Context and background]].
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Line 32: Line 28:
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
Received at Madras, March, 1883.
Received at Madras, March, 1883.
{{Col-break|width=3%}}


{{Col-break|width=15%}}
{{Col-break|width=15%}}
[[File:ML 0-0.JPG|100px|center]]
[http://www.theosophy.wiki/mywiki/images/ML/108-0_Cover_sheet_6875.jpg http://www.theosophy.wiki/mywiki/images/ML/108-0_Cover_sheet_6875_thm.jpg]


{{Col-break|width=30%}}
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
Line 41: Line 39:


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
== Page 1 transcription, image, and notes ==
== Page 1 transcription, image, and notes ==


Line 47: Line 46:
My Dear "Ward,"
My Dear "Ward,"


We will not, if you please, deal at present with the situation concerning "stars" & <u>obscuration</u> — for reasons very plainly told to you this morning by H.P.B. My task becomes with every letter more dangerous. It becomes exceedingly difficult to teach you and hold at the same time strictly to the original programme: "so far shall we go & no further." Yet — hold to it we <u>must</u> & <u>will</u>.
We will not, if you please, deal at present with the situation concerning "stars" & <u>[[Pralaya#Obscuration|obscuration]]</u> — for reasons very plainly told to you this morning by [[Helena Petrovna Blavatsky|H.P.B.]] My task becomes with every letter more dangerous. It becomes exceedingly difficult to teach you and hold at the same time strictly to the original programme: "so far shall we go & no further." Yet — hold to it we <u>must</u> & <u>will</u>.


You have entirely mistaken my meaning in the telegram. The words: "more at Adyar" related to the true explanation of your vision, not by any means, to a promise of some  
You have entirely mistaken my meaning in the telegram. The words: "more at [[Adyar (campus)|Adyar]]" related to the true explanation of your vision, not by any means, to a promise of some  


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 58: Line 57:
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
'''NOTES:'''
'''NOTES:'''
*  
*'''Concerning "stars" & obscuration'''.  The Sinnetts stopped in Madras before sailing to England. He was working on his next book [[Esoteric Buddhism (book)|''Esoteric Buddhism'']] and had sent some questions through [["The_Shrine"#Sinnett.27s_testimony|"the shrine"]].


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
Line 66: Line 65:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
further psychological experiments made in that direction by myself. The vision was due to an attempt by D.K. who is extremely interested in your progress. While he succeeded in getting you out of your body, he failed entirely in his effort to open your inner vision, for reasons correctly surmised at the time by yourself. I took no personal active part in the attempt. Hence my answer "surmises correct — more at Adyar." I am in a very false position just now, and have — in order not
further psychological experiments made in that direction by myself. The vision was due to an attempt by [[Djual Khool|D.K.]] who is extremely interested in your progress. While he succeeded in getting you out of your body, he failed entirely in his effort to open your inner vision, for reasons correctly surmised at the time by yourself. I took no personal active part in the attempt. Hence my answer "surmises correct — more at Adyar." I am in a very false position just now, and have — in order not


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 85: Line 84:
to jeopardise the possibilities of the future — to be doubly cautious.
to jeopardise the possibilities of the future — to be doubly cautious.


The probable date of your departure? Well — on or about April 7th. If your impatience disagrees with this desire of mine you are free to do as you like. Yet, I would look upon it as a personal favour. I am profoundly disgusted with the apathy of my countrymen in general. More than ever I trust but in the few staunch workers of the luckless and hapless T.S. The Viceroy's letter would be of the greatest help if it could be but judiciously used. But in such matters, I see
The probable date of your departure? Well — on or about [[April 7]]th. If your impatience disagrees with this desire of mine you are free to do as you like. Yet, I would look upon it as a personal favour. I am profoundly disgusted with the apathy of my countrymen in general. More than ever I trust but in the few staunch workers of the luckless and hapless [[Theosophical Society|T.S.]] The Viceroy's letter would be of the greatest help if it could be but judiciously used. But in such matters, I see


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 94: Line 93:
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
'''NOTES:'''
'''NOTES:'''
*
* '''On or about April 7th.''' The Sinnetts eventually sailed for Europe on [[March 30]], 1883.
* '''The Viceroy''' refers to Lord Ripon, then British Viceroy of India. Mr. Sinnett had met with him in Calcutta, on his way to Madras.


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
Line 102: Line 102:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
I am no judge, as I now augur from the impression left on your mind by R. Srinavasa Rao and others.
I am no judge, as I now augur from the impression left on your mind by [[P. Srinivasa Rao|R. Srinavasa Rao]] and others.


The incident of February the 7th being explained, your question relating to "earlier restrictions" is already covered.
The incident of [[February 7|February the 7th]] being explained, your question relating to "earlier restrictions" is already covered.


May I beg of you two more personal and important favours? 1st — to ever bear in mind that <u>whenever</u> & <u>whatever</u> is possible will be always done for you unurged; hence <u>never</u> to either ask for, or suggest it, yourself — since it will amount to simply avoiding to me the supremely disagreeable task of having to refuse a friend's request without, moreover, being in a position to explain the reason why;
May I beg of you two more personal and important favours? 1st — to ever bear in mind that <u>whenever</u> & <u>whatever</u> is possible will be always done for you unurged; hence <u>never</u> to either ask for, or suggest it, yourself — since it will amount to simply avoiding to me the supremely disagreeable task of having to refuse a friend's request without, moreover, being in a position to explain the reason why;
Line 123: Line 123:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
and second — to remember that though personally and for your own sake I may be prepared to do a great deal I have in no way bound myself to do anything of the sort for the Fellows of the British T.S. I have pledged my word to you to teach them through your kind agency — our philosophy and whether they accept it or not. But I have never undertaken to convince any of them of the extent of our powers nor even of our personal existence. Their belief or disbelief in the latter is a matter of very trifling importance to us indeed. If they are ever
and 2nd — to remember that though personally and for <u>your own sake</u> I may be prepared to do a great deal I have in no way bound myself to do anything of the sort for the Fellows of the [[London Lodge|British T.S.]] I have pledged my word to you to teach them through your kind agency — [[Esoteric Philosophy|our philosophy]] and whether they accept it or not. But I have never undertaken to convince any of them of the extent of our [[Siddhi|powers]] nor even of our personal existence. Their belief or disbelief in the latter is a matter of very trifling importance to us indeed. If they are ever


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 141: Line 141:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
to be benefitted by our promise, it must be through you, alone and your own personal efforts. Nor can you ever see me (in flesh), — not even in a clearly defined vision — unless you are prepared to pledge your honour never to reveal the fact to anyone, so long as you live, (save you receive permission to that effect). That the consequence of such a pledge will be a never satisfied as an ever recurring doubt in the minds of your British Fellows — is just what we want for the present. Too much, or too little was said and proved of us as M.A. (Oxon)
to be beneffited by our promise, it must be through you, alone and your own personal efforts. Nor can you ever see me (in flesh), — not even in a clearly defined vision — unless you are prepared to pledge your honour never to reveal the fact to anyone, so long as you live, (save you receive permission to that effect). That the consequence of such a pledge will be a never satisfied as an ever recurring doubt in the minds of your British Fellows — <u>is just what we want for the present</u>. Too much, or too little was said and proved of us as [[William Stainton Moses|M.A. (Oxon)]]


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 151: Line 151:
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
'''NOTES:'''
'''NOTES:'''
*
* '''M.A. (Oxon)''' is how [[William Stainton Moses]] signed his articles. It reflects the Master's degree that he earned at Exeter College, Oxford.


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
Line 159: Line 159:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
justly remarked. We are ordered to set ourselves to work to sweep away the few vestiges — for which fresh policy you are indebted to the incessant underground intrigues of our ex-friend Mr. Hume — (now entirely in the hands of the Brothers of the Shadow) — and the more our actual existence be doubted — the better. As to tests and convincing proofs to the Sadducees of Europe generally and those of England especially — this is something to be left entirely out of our future programme. Unless allowed to use our own judgment and means — the course of future events will by no means run smooth. Thus you should never use such phrases as "for the sake of strength  
justly remarked. <u>We are ordered</u> to set ourselves to work to sweep away the few vestiges — for which fresh policy you are indebted to the incessant <u>underground</u> intrigues of our ex-friend [[Allan Octavian Hume|Mr. Hume]] — (now entirely in the hands of the [[Brothers of the Shadow]]) — and the more our actual existence be doubted — the better. As to tests and convincing proofs to the Sadducees of Europe generally and those of England especially — this is something to be left entirely out of our future programme. Unless allowed to use our own judgment and means — the course of future events will by no means run smooth. Thus you should never use such phrases as "for the sake of strength  
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}


Line 167: Line 167:
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
{{Col-break|width=30%}}
'''NOTES:'''
'''NOTES:'''
* Sadducees were members of a high-status Jewish sect in ancient Israel, who maintained the (Second) Temple and had other political, social, and religious roles.
* '''Sadducees''' were members of a high-status Jewish sect in ancient Israel, who maintained the (Second) Temple and had other political, social, and religious roles.


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
Line 175: Line 175:
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-begin|width=98%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
{{Col-break|width=55%}}
with friends at home" as they would be sure to do no good and would simply irritate the more the other "powers that be" — to use the ridiculous phrase. It is not always flattering, good friend, to be placed even by those one likes the best — on the same level with shells and mediums — for the purpose of tests. I thought you had luckily outgrown that stage. Let us hold at present to the simply intellectual aspect of our intercourse and busy ourselves but with philosophy and — your future paper and leave the rest to time and its unforeseen developments.
with friends at home" as they would be sure to do no good and would simply irritate the more the <u>other</u> "powers that be" — to use the ridiculous phrase. It is not always flattering, good friend, to be placed even by those one likes the best — on the same level with [[Kāmaloka#Shells|<u>shells</u>]] and [[Mediumship|mediums]] — for the purpose of <u>tests</u>. I thought you had luckily outgrown that stage. Let us hold at present to the simply intellectual aspect of our <u>intercourse</u> and busy ourselves but with philosophy and — your future paper and leave the rest to <u>time</u> & <u>its unforeseen developments</u>.


It is precisely because I follow and perceive the dual working of your mind in making such requests that I sign myself invariably
It is precisely because I follow and perceive the dual working of your mind in making such requests that I sign myself invariably
Line 181: Line 181:
Your affectionate friend,
Your affectionate friend,


K. H.
[[Koot Hoomi|K. H.]]


{{Col-break|width=3%}}
{{Col-break|width=3%}}
Line 193: Line 193:


{{Col-end}}
{{Col-end}}
== Context and background ==
== Context and background ==


Line 211: Line 212:
== Notes ==
== Notes ==
<references/>
<references/>
<br>


== Additional resources ==
[[Category:ML from Koot Hoomi]]
[[Category:ML needs background]]
[[Category:ML to A. P. Sinnett]]
[[Category:ML with images]]
[[Category:ML needs commentary]]

Latest revision as of 01:55, 15 April 2022

Quick Facts
People involved
Written by: Koot Hoomi
Received by: A. P. Sinnett
Sent via: unknown
Dates
Written on: unknown
Received on: March 1883
Other dates: unknown
Places
Sent from: unknown
Received at: Madras, India
Via: unknown 

This is Letter No. 108 in The Mahatma Letters to A. P. Sinnett, 4th chronological edition. It corresponds to Letter No. 58 in Barker numbering. See below for Context and background.

< Prev letter chrono  Next letter chrono >  
< Prev letter Barker  Next letter Barker >

Cover sheet

Received at Madras, March, 1883.

108-0_Cover_sheet_6875_thm.jpg

NOTES:

Page 1 transcription, image, and notes

My Dear "Ward,"

We will not, if you please, deal at present with the situation concerning "stars" & obscuration — for reasons very plainly told to you this morning by H.P.B. My task becomes with every letter more dangerous. It becomes exceedingly difficult to teach you and hold at the same time strictly to the original programme: "so far shall we go & no further." Yet — hold to it we must & will.

You have entirely mistaken my meaning in the telegram. The words: "more at Adyar" related to the true explanation of your vision, not by any means, to a promise of some

108-1_6876_thm.jpg

NOTES:

  • Concerning "stars" & obscuration. The Sinnetts stopped in Madras before sailing to England. He was working on his next book Esoteric Buddhism and had sent some questions through "the shrine".

Page 2

further psychological experiments made in that direction by myself. The vision was due to an attempt by D.K. who is extremely interested in your progress. While he succeeded in getting you out of your body, he failed entirely in his effort to open your inner vision, for reasons correctly surmised at the time by yourself. I took no personal active part in the attempt. Hence my answer "surmises correct — more at Adyar." I am in a very false position just now, and have — in order not

108-2_6877_thm.jpg

NOTES:

Page 3

to jeopardise the possibilities of the future — to be doubly cautious.

The probable date of your departure? Well — on or about April 7th. If your impatience disagrees with this desire of mine you are free to do as you like. Yet, I would look upon it as a personal favour. I am profoundly disgusted with the apathy of my countrymen in general. More than ever I trust but in the few staunch workers of the luckless and hapless T.S. The Viceroy's letter would be of the greatest help if it could be but judiciously used. But in such matters, I see

108-3_6878_thm.jpg

NOTES:

  • On or about April 7th. The Sinnetts eventually sailed for Europe on March 30, 1883.
  • The Viceroy refers to Lord Ripon, then British Viceroy of India. Mr. Sinnett had met with him in Calcutta, on his way to Madras.

Page 4

I am no judge, as I now augur from the impression left on your mind by R. Srinavasa Rao and others.

The incident of February the 7th being explained, your question relating to "earlier restrictions" is already covered.

May I beg of you two more personal and important favours? 1st — to ever bear in mind that whenever & whatever is possible will be always done for you unurged; hence never to either ask for, or suggest it, yourself — since it will amount to simply avoiding to me the supremely disagreeable task of having to refuse a friend's request without, moreover, being in a position to explain the reason why;

108-4_6879_thm.jpg

NOTES:

Page 5

and 2nd — to remember that though personally and for your own sake I may be prepared to do a great deal I have in no way bound myself to do anything of the sort for the Fellows of the British T.S. I have pledged my word to you to teach them through your kind agency — our philosophy and whether they accept it or not. But I have never undertaken to convince any of them of the extent of our powers nor even of our personal existence. Their belief or disbelief in the latter is a matter of very trifling importance to us indeed. If they are ever

108-5_6880_thm.jpg


NOTES:

Page 6

to be beneffited by our promise, it must be through you, alone and your own personal efforts. Nor can you ever see me (in flesh), — not even in a clearly defined vision — unless you are prepared to pledge your honour never to reveal the fact to anyone, so long as you live, (save you receive permission to that effect). That the consequence of such a pledge will be a never satisfied as an ever recurring doubt in the minds of your British Fellows — is just what we want for the present. Too much, or too little was said and proved of us as M.A. (Oxon)

108-6_6881_thm.jpg


NOTES:

  • M.A. (Oxon) is how William Stainton Moses signed his articles. It reflects the Master's degree that he earned at Exeter College, Oxford.

Page 7

justly remarked. We are ordered to set ourselves to work to sweep away the few vestiges — for which fresh policy you are indebted to the incessant underground intrigues of our ex-friend Mr. Hume — (now entirely in the hands of the Brothers of the Shadow) — and the more our actual existence be doubted — the better. As to tests and convincing proofs to the Sadducees of Europe generally and those of England especially — this is something to be left entirely out of our future programme. Unless allowed to use our own judgment and means — the course of future events will by no means run smooth. Thus you should never use such phrases as "for the sake of strength

108-7_6882_thm.jpg

NOTES:

  • Sadducees were members of a high-status Jewish sect in ancient Israel, who maintained the (Second) Temple and had other political, social, and religious roles.

Page 8

with friends at home" as they would be sure to do no good and would simply irritate the more the other "powers that be" — to use the ridiculous phrase. It is not always flattering, good friend, to be placed even by those one likes the best — on the same level with shells and mediums — for the purpose of tests. I thought you had luckily outgrown that stage. Let us hold at present to the simply intellectual aspect of our intercourse and busy ourselves but with philosophy and — your future paper and leave the rest to time & its unforeseen developments.

It is precisely because I follow and perceive the dual working of your mind in making such requests that I sign myself invariably

Your affectionate friend,

K. H.

108-8_6883_thm.jpg

NOTES:

Context and background

Physical description of letter

The original is in the British Library, Folio 2. George Linton and Virginia Hanson described the letter this way:

KH script in light blue pencil on two sheets of smooth folded note paper, 5" X 8" [12.7 X 20.3 cm], heavy lettering on all four sides.[1]

Publication history

Commentary about this letter

Notes

  1. George E. Linton and Virginia Hanson, eds., Readers Guide to The Mahatma Letters to A. P. Sinnett (Adyar, Chennai, India: Theosophical Publishing House, 1972), 175.